More on AVNOJ - John Tschinkel

Forum 2002 - 2013
Beiträge: 220
Registriert: So Feb 12, 2023 6:09 pm

More on AVNOJ - John Tschinkel

Beitrag von Forum 2002 - 2013 »

Abgeschickt von John Tschinkel am 06 Dezember, 2002 um 16:46:13:

Response by J. Tschinkel to entry of "Beobachter".

The standard reaction to any challenge of the AG (now including the GHGA), is a personal attack using fabricated falsehoods. This is so because the truth is not on their side. The entry of 30/11/02 is no different except that its falsehoods are clearly created by a deficient and an illogical mind.

The writer of that entry obviously never read the AVNOJ Decrees. Had he done so he would have learned that they were directed only toward expelling the occupier and his supporters. Any nation has the right to expel an invader, in this case the Germans of the Third Reich and the Fascist of Italy. Included were ALL supporters of the invader, be they ethnic-German, ethnic-Italian or ethnic-Slovene.

The Beobachter is also ignorant of the truth about the loss of our Gottscheer homeland. As part of the voluntary exodus in 1941, all Gottscheer, my family included, decided to become Citizens of the Third Reich. We, like all other Gottscheer became part of the invader when we occupied ('41-'45) the homes of expelled Slovene and fled to Austria in May 1945 as ordered by the Nazi Gauleiter.

For the AG and now the GHGA, to press for the abolition of the AVNOJ Decrees is morally wrong. It clearly places us on the side of the Nazi occupier. And I as a Gottscheer-American, still mindful of the Pledge of Allegiance to my adopted country, want it known that I am not part of this stand. We have by any standard no right, moral or otherwise, to make such demands which is the reason why they are ignored by all nations.

I do not have dual Slovene-American citizenship. If I did I would not deny it. My Slovene mother had no property in Masern which I regained. My family (Gottscheer father, Slovene mother) voluntarily like other Gottscheer elsewhere, left our property in Masern and we never regained it.

To say I have a right to Slovene citizenship because my mother was Slovene is false as is the claim that ethnic Germans born in Slovenia do not have the right to be Slovene citizens. Erik Krisch and Avgust Grill, both ethnic Germans and leaders of resident Gottscheer Vereins in Slovenia were born in Slovenia, are Slovene citizens today and have all the rights other Slovenes have.

Members and supporters of the Nazi occupier can not regain their property. My family, my Slovene mother included, became part of the occupier. AVNOJ applied to us and still does so today. The Decrees apply to all Slovene who cooperated with the invader. But my family, like most Gottscheer, was reimbursed by postwar Germany who thereby admitted responsibility for our loss. To now pressure the Slovene to give us what we voluntarily left behind in 1941 is both immoral and revolting.

We always hear from the AG how ethnic Germans were mistreated. (All supporters of the Nazi occupier were mistreated). But we never hear of the brutal mistreatment of the 37,000 Slovene who were forcibly removed from their homes and taken to Nazi labor and concentration camps to make room for us. Over half of them died and the survivors received no compensation. These Slovene were mistreated because they were Slovene who happened to be in the way of the occupier. But most Gottscheer survived and got reimbursed by the German state.

The AVNOJ Decrees will not be abolished since a moral imperative to do so does not exist. The whole western world, including Germany, agrees on this. Proof is in the fact that Slovenia is now a member of NATO and has met all requirements for joining the EU in 2004. Pressure from the AG and GHGA notwithstanding.

The AG (now including the GHGA) is playing a dirty game in influencing its members to support an immoral cause. But this is not surprising given the fact that former Gottscheer Nazis and even a former SS officer are "Honored Members" and "Advisers" within the AG.
Zuletzt geändert von Forum 2002 - 2013 am So Feb 19, 2023 5:08 pm, insgesamt 1-mal geändert.
Forum 2002 - 2013
Beiträge: 220
Registriert: So Feb 12, 2023 6:09 pm

Re: More on AVNOJ - Beobachter

Beitrag von Forum 2002 - 2013 »

Abgeschickt von Beobachter am 29 Dezember, 2002 um 20:03:51:

Antwort auf: More on AVNOJ von John Tschinkel am 06 Dezember, 2002 um 16:46:13:

Reply of Jim Heimann to AVNOJ Decrees posted by J. Tschinkel

Dear John,

I have done my best to ignore your seemingly one sided attacks on everyone who does not agree with your particular point of view. In past online discussions, you have repeatedly ignored anything that resembled a different view of the post war era.

As I have said before, my ancestors came over well before the start of WW II and, as such, I have no interest in obtaining land that had once belonged to my ancestors. They did not have much anyhow or they would not have come to the United States.

Concerning the AVNOJ decrees, you appear to hold out a set of documents enacted by a brutal Communist regime at the end of a hard fought war as an ideal that should be adhered to greater than fifty years later. This regime killed thousands and thousands of people to rid themselves of anyone -- Slovene and nonSlovene alike, who might cause them a problem.

As for the Potsdam Conference in 1945, there were so many quid pro quo agreements being passed back and forth that it would make your head spin. The AVNOJ decrees were part and parcel of agreements that solidified the Communists hold on eastern Europe in exchange for weakening the communist movement in Greece and other areas. Again, it is folly to point to the Potsdam conference as a beacon for anything but political expediency.

With respect to the recent statements (as asserted by you) made by the current Slovene president, would anyone expect him to say anything else? His reaction is not only predictable but understandable. Wrongs were done before, during, and after the war by all parties.

Concerning the actions of the Gottscheers in the early 1940s, many of their choices were dictated by the actions of both the Yugoslavian government after World War I and the Nazi government before and during World War II. It is my understanding that the Yugoslavian government made it very clear through laws that the ethnic Germans were no longer welcome in a land that they had lived in for over 600 years. The choice was to either leave Gottschee or to gradually give up the AustroGerman traditions. The Nazis played on inherent and increased ethnic tensions to get the Gottscheers to move out of a place that many never wanted to leave. These ethnic tensions were exacerbated by the intolerance of the Yugoslavian government after 1917.

The Nazis were 100% in the wrong for deportation and imprisonment of Slovene nationals. Although the Gottscheers ultimately came to occupy their houses and lands, this was not a decision made by them or enacted by them. Some Gottscheer leaders, as you have asserted, were likely to have been aware of more details but the vast populace was very much in the dark.

After the war was over, it surprises me that you think the Gottscheers had any choice other than to flee. They had been legislated against since 1917, they had been the subject of partisan attacks, they were noncommunist and they were ethnic AustroGermans. Anyone of those circumstances would have been enough to convince me to "hightail" it out of there. The Yugoslavian government was not kind to those that they felt had either been a threat or might continue to be a threat. If the Gottscheers had remained, I am sure there would have been wholesale slaughter. Enough fellow Gottscheers died in the attempt to flee to underscore the point sufficiently.

I am not sufficiently versed on either the full import of the AVNOJ decrees or the AG resolution. As such, I am not sure where I stand on the issue. As a matter of fact, I just would like to be able to visit where my ancestors came from in peace and quiet. All I know is that your reasoning on past history is illogical and less than factual enough to make me wonder about the rest of your assertions.

Because there are some of us who do not agree with your agenda and reasoning, it does not mean that we are neoNazis or Nazi sympathizers. For my part, I happen to think that your views (of the Yugoslavian government under Tito, the allied powers, and the actions of all concerned before, during, and after the war) are much too one sided for me.

Finally, I send this reply in the hope that something I have typed may make some sense to you. If it fails in doing that, I hope that others take the time to read it and see that there may be a less dogmatic way to look at past history and current events.


Jim Heimann
Zuletzt geändert von Forum 2002 - 2013 am So Feb 19, 2023 5:08 pm, insgesamt 1-mal geändert.
Forum 2002 - 2013
Beiträge: 220
Registriert: So Feb 12, 2023 6:09 pm

Response to Jim Heimann (posted by Beobachter) - J. Tschinkel

Beitrag von Forum 2002 - 2013 »

Abgeschickt von J. Tschinkel am 01 Januar, 2003 um 18:11:55

Antwort auf: Re: More on AVNOJ von Beobachter am 29 Dezember, 2002 um 20:03:51:

Dear Jim,
On a re-read of your letter I realized that it might have been written by the AG. If not in fact, certainly in spirit.

You chastise me for "one sided attacks". But you really chastise me for speaking out against the line disseminated by the AG for the last 40 years. You dutifully repeat this line by stating their reasons why we left and what would have happened had we stayed. And, in typical fashion, words fail you when it comes to relevant current issues where suddenly you are not "sufficiently versed".

You, like most descendants are not aware of (or wish to acknowledge) the persuasion of the individuals who have been crafting and disseminating this line through the Gottscheer Zeitung since its publication resumed in 1955 in Klagenfurt. It's first Editor Fritz Högler, was against re-politicizing the paper and was replaced in 1962. His replacement was Herbert Erker, a former Nazi, an inner circle member of Lampeter's VGL (Volksgruppenleitung) and the Editor and propaganda chief of the GZ during '38-'41. The Gottscheer Zeitung was the newspaper Lampeter used to coerce the Gottscheer into leaving their homeland.

On Erker's retirement in 1971, the editor became Ludwig Kren. Kren was (and still is) an intimate friend of both Lampeter, Lackner and was Erker's assistant on the GZ between '38- '41. Richard Lackner was Lampeter's Chief of Staff and after WW2 became Chairman of the Landsmannschaft in Germany. Surrounding this inner circle is the retinue of lesser members of the VGL; most of them again leaders in Gottscheer organizations within the AG. All committed to justify the resettlement, deflect any blame from themselves and place the blame entirely on the Slovene. Certainly not the Nazis. To paraphrase your words; "… would anyone expect them to say anything else?"

YES! An apology to the Gottscheer people whom they deliberately misled and lied to and an apology to those Slovene whose homes we occupied and whose lives were destroyed as a result. (They would have been left in place had we not resettled). We Gottscheer could have, long ago, cast off the pervasive taint of Nazism had we forced such a catharsis. But for obvious reasons this was not to be.
I discussed this with Klagenfurt, but was forcefully rebuffed. (Deviants are not tolerated). But again, as in 1941, they judged correctly the Gottscheer as gullible people, easy to be misled. And they were successful. I, however, decided to expose them.

Their 'Blame the Slovene' effort went into high gear and became extortive when the former SS officer emerged from East Germany in 1989. Lampeter was welcomed by all the leaders of the AG at a special meeting in Munich on Oct. 15 and promptly made an "Ehrenmitglied", a "Kulturreferent" and given a medal. Erker, Lackner and Kren had been so honored long before that.

I visited Lampeter in Leipzig in Nov. 1994, when he was not yet aware of my deviant perspectives. He called himself the savior ("Retter") of the Gottscheer people and if "he" had not moved us, we all would have been killed. He also defined for me his version of truth: " a logical formulation of certain facts". (Used by the AG for over four decades. It does work well with those who need an excuse, are ignorant of facts and those who don't think).

But Herr Lampeter, I am puzzled; in 1941, at the peak of Nazi power and success in Europe, you already knew that Germany was going to loose the war in 1945 and that is why you moved us? And that the Partisans were going to kill us all in 1945 if we did not move in 1941? Is this not hindsight, I asked? His angry reply was: "I see we are opponents"! (not a follower because I would not accept hindsight as facts)!

"We had to either leave Gottschee or give up our Gottscheer traditions" was another piece of his wisdom, nearly identical to the one used by you.

Not much of an excuse from either of you, considering that in 1941 resettlement was no longer necessary. We no longer lived in Yugoslavia, but in Mussolini's Italy, a country that was the closest ally of Hitler who was in a position to guarantee our traditions as a Minority for the next 1000 years.

By the way, Yugoslavia was formed in 1918, not in 1917, as you state. With such prowess in historical facts, including hindsight, your are hardly a credible critic to claim: "All I know is that your reasoning on past history is illogical and less than factual enough to make me wonder about the rest of your assertions".

The published Ingathering Policy of the Third Reich is never mentioned. But in the schools after the resettlement into ethnically cleansed Slovenia, we kids (I was there) were no longer allowed to converse in Gottscheer. The paragraphs of the Ingathering Policy forbade that and the teachers enforced it. Only German was allowed. The VGL knew all this in advance and this fact alone proves it is they who brought to an end the Gottscheer as an Ethnic Group, to disappear forever into the Germany of the 1000 Year Reich.

But all this and much more, is the past and useful only as a more factual historical perspective. The deed was done, let’s draw a line, get rid of those who betrayed our heritage, make peace with the Slovene and go honorably forward.

Instead, we allow the atrophied members of the traitorous VGA cling to their discredited beliefs, perpetuate the racial hatred and seek renewed confrontation.

I, however, would not tolerate the use of aggressive politics (based on hindsight, manipulated facts and lies) toward the new Slovenia by those who facilitated our end as an Ethnic Group. Conscience bound, I reacted with a campaign to expose them and their efforts, a task in which I was very successful.

As said above, their effort went into high gear after the return of former SS officer Lampeter into the leadership ranks. Demands of the AG were brought to the EU, the German Government and the Austrian Government via Jöerg Haider, the leader of the FPO who publicly praised the SS. (nice company the AG keeps). Germany and Austria were asked to prevent the entry of Slovenia into the EU unless the demands of the AG are met. The demands were restitution (after already having been compensated by Germany) and Minority recognition for less than 50 Gottscheer Slovene, i.e. some of those who stayed. (State paid German schooling, separate voting rights, election of a representative in Parliament, road signs in German, etc). Non of these demands were taken seriously by anyone, anywhere.

Needless to say, the AG was making a fool of itself throughout Europe, especially once the political orientation and make-up of the AG leadership became known. I believe that I contributed to this awareness through extensive correspondence with all the involved governments including the EU. My widely distributed booklet; The End of the Gottscheer as an Ethnic Group in English, German and Slovene was, among other items, a vehicle toward this goal. And now, that all Europeans are again aware of the history of the Gottscheer and their leaders, the AG has become known as an obsolete and irrelevant anachronism.

The final drive by the AG, to have Slovenia abolish the AVNOJ decrees has, like all the other drives also come to nothing. As you may know, on Dec. 14, '02, the EU announced that Slovenia met all requirements for membership and will enter the Union in 2004. In spite of the AG and the GHGA. Slovenia also recently became a full member of NATO.

When I joined the GHGA as a Life member, I had hoped it would remain non-political as it claimed to be. When it joined the AG, I resigned. And when the GHGA cosigned the Resolution of August 2002, petitioning Austria to press Slovenia to invalidate AVNOJ, I realized that even this part of the Gottscheer community has subordinated itself to the self deceptive slogans of the former Nazis. I do not wish to be part of any such community.

Fortunately there is the another half of my ancestral line of which I am proud and able to fall back on for an honorable heritage. I am very happy that this little country of Slovenia, which struggled throughout the 19th and part of the 20th Century against the germanizing colonialism of the Empire, was under the thumbs of the Serbs until overrun by brutal Fascists, and after that, having lived another 53 years under another form of totalitarianism, finally found its place in the sun.

But you only see it as part of a regime that "killed thousands and thousands" to get rid of the super race invader. Of its history you appear to know little. You have a blind eye for the "thousands and thousands" of Slovene who were killed by the invading Nazis while defending their country. (no matter under what banner and the fact that defender of the country was communist is to me [the Slovene and other Europeans], irrelevant). That fact that you mention the killing by one side and not the other, betrays your leaning.

You see it only as a "place to visit in peace and quiet" oblivious to the fact that as a member of the AG (via the GHGA) you approve of the extortive demands on the citizens of the state you visit and whose only sin was that they expelled a brutal invader. The Slovene are fully aware that it was the Nazis not the Germans who were the invaders, a concept understood everywhere but one that still escapes the Gottscheer. But they are a generous and tolerant people, ready to forgive and forget and let you "visit in peace and quiet". And the Slovene we displaced have made no demands on either the Germans or the Gottscheer for pain and suffering.

The AG, most Gottscheer and now the GHGA could have cleansed themselves of the "taint" if they were so inclined. This taint may disappear on its own after several generations die out. But by then the Gottscheer will be even more irrelevant than they are today. Not even background noise. We will have disappeared without honor into the dustbin of history, remembered, if at all, only for our self delusion.

For myself, I have accomplished what I set out to do. I helped bring to naught the extortive demands of those who once succeeded to betray us and twice to deceive us. The land of my maternal ancestry has been accepted into the family of nations in spite of the AG, and I am proud of them. I wish I could say the same for the other half of my heritage.

Sincerely, John Tschinkel